rear suspension inner toelink
Question:
marcw's picture of the failed rod end is typical of bolted joints failures. The nut loosened (most likely due to improper torque or vibration), the bolt portion of the rod end migrated and bending loads were imparted causing failure by fatigue.

The anti-rotation flats on the rod end are parallel with the ground when the rod end is installed, therefore after the nut loosened, the rod end was free to bend in the inward and outwards directions due to cornering loads. marcw, I imagine you didn't rotate the remaining bolt in the rod end after it was removed? From the orientation of your pic, it shows inboard cornering loads (going around a corner with the affected wheel on the outside of the turn) caused a larger crack to propagate on the outside portion of the bolt. Cracks propagated from both sides of the bolt until the remaining material was not sufficient to carry the loads and the inner portion failed under tension.

Anyway, the key is to prevent the nut from loosening. This seems like a perfect opportunity to safety wire the nut after torque is applied, or second best if it works, using a Nord-Loc washer (depends of the relative hardness of the nut and material under nut and the amount of thread available). Nord-Locks are cheap and very effective when they work.
http://www.nord-lock.com/ as i have been reading this thread with interest and concern, i was thing the same thing. saftey wire. we had to do it for many critacl parts on the motorclycle before we raced them and went through tech inspections. for me it was also always a reminder that I went through these and did in fact check and tighten them , visually i could see it, and then "let it go". from your avatar milcher, i can see why you and I are both fans of saftey wire, i love the stuff.
Answer:
This is one of those things track guy need to keep on top of. A race car is often nut and bolted at all major suspension points before each event or run. All the good cobras and spec racer and formula guys do this stuff before events, skip barber cars run a hugh amount of track time with very little mechanical failure becasue they have the routine down. Thanks Stan for the info. it will become a pre track part of my check list. Lotus sport US needs to get behind the movement and offer this stuff ( track toe brace,tech support) in a readliy accessable and afforable manner to support the customer, it is part of the Lotus experience and will help make the customer feel the company is looking after them. i think this is a great idea, it might be allot of work, but HUGLY aprreciate if someone could comprise a thorough pre track day check list routine, that was comprehensive , maybe had pictures, and showed a thought out order to do the items in so wheels(and others items) are removed only once. just an idea, and if I had the experience or knowledge, i would attempt it, i havent, but would sure like to become an expert, but butt is counting on it. sounds like investing in a nice lift would be worthwhile now too..............(seen some for less than $2,000) awesome info here thanks for sharing the knowledge. i had never thought about any of this stuff, but am grateful for reading this and being made aware of the need to really"go through the entire car" before running HPDE. with the tires screaming as they were on corners, there has to be stress put on these components.
Josh
Answer:
Stan checked my torques last night and we found the passenger side up to spec, but the drivers side was between a 1/4 to a 1/2 turn loose. It was a PITA to check without dropping the under-tray.
One option is to take wheels off and use jack stands to support a-arms to have car level. This will compress suspension to its normal level. I had to use U-joint and extension to operate torque wrench.
Answer:
One option is to take wheels off and use jack stands to support a-arms to have car level. This will compress suspension to its normal level. I had to use U-joint and extension to operate torque wrench.
The '' U- joint and torque wrench may not be a good idea, as any angle off
the axis of asymmrtry of the bolt will vary the torque value. I check this on any car that does not have a service history with me, I never asume any other tech or owner's maintaince diligence or the accuracy of their tools.
All the best, Don
Answer:
Oh hell, I have no idea of what any of these are, and all I use my Elise for is tracking!!
Torque Settings: All in Nm
- Upper and lower wishbone pivot bolts 45
- Upper and lower swivel joint ball pins 55
- Upper swivel joint plinth to hub carrier 68 = Camber Bolts
- Toe-link outer ball joint to hub carrier 55
- Toe-link inner ball joint/wishbone to subframe 50
- Toe-link ball joint lock nuts 45
- Damper to lower wishbone 45
- Damper to chassis 45
- Brake caliper to hub carrier - upper M10 45 - 50
- lower M8 26 - 30
- Hub bearing unit to hub carrier 90
- Rear hub nut 220
- Wheel to hub 105 (78 lb-ft) Anyone know a good reliable track friendly shop in the LA-Hollywood area who could check this new set of worries?
Answer:
The '' U- joint and torque wrench may not be a good idea, as any angle off
the axis of asymmrtry of the bolt will vary the torque value. I check this on any car that does not have a service history with me, I never asume any other tech or owner's maintaince diligence or the accuracy of their tools.
All the best, Don
... and don't even think about bringing up the subject of a crows foot and a Torque wrench. I've derailed many an Engineer (PE) w/ that subject
Answer:
Oh hell, I have no idea of what any of these are, and all I use my Elise for is tracking!!

Anyone know a good reliable track friendly shop in the LA-Hollywood area who could check this new set of worries?
Yup - Call Tom over at Lucent Motors and tell him I sent you. He's set up many Elise/Exige for the track, including Jack's, Sector111's, Ronin's, mine, etc.

EDIT: Now I'll be able to rest assured that our cars are completely identical.
Answer:
... and don't even think about bringing up the subject of a crows foot and a Torque wrench. I've derailed many an Engineer (PE) w/ that subject
Memories...
Answer:
EDIT: Now I'll be able to rest assured that our cars are completely identical. You mean you have the same wildly expensive mis-matched paint job with all the rough edges and broken promises of "We'll call you when we have the right glue to fix it" too??
Answer:
You mean you have the same wildly expensive third rate mis-matched paint job with all the rough edges and broken promises of "We'll call you when we have the right glue to fix it" too??
No, happy to say that's not the case. Want to call me and talk about it? You have a PM
Answer:
I went to to Lotus's main site and sent them a message regarding this issue, and our concerns. I suggest other owners do the same.
http://www.grouplotus.com/contact/ge....php?section=1
Answer:
Oh hell, I have no idea of what any of these are, and all I use my Elise for is tracking!! Anyone know a good reliable track friendly shop in the LA-Hollywood area who could check this new set of worries?
Try your Lotus dealer. There are just a few critical areas to check before a track day. This is not brain surgery, but needs to actually be done to the car.
Answer:
The '' U- joint and torque wrench may not be a good idea, as any angle off
the axis of asymmrtry of the bolt will vary the torque value. I check this on any car that does not have a service history with me, I never asume any other tech or owner's maintaince diligence or the accuracy of their tools. All the best, Don
I think it's even worse than that...u-joints are not constant velocity joints...so the amount they change the torque reading...will vary as they are turned. Might as well do it by the book, no u-joints, crow's feet, etc.

There is a lot of FUD here. Wheels off or at an oil change, checking torque is not a time consuming or difficult procedure.
Answer:
as i have been reading this thread with interest and concern, i was thing the same thing. saftey wire. we had to do it for many critacl parts on the motorclycle before we raced them and went through tech inspections. for me it was also always a reminder that I went through these and did in fact check and tighten them , visually i could see it, and then "let it go". from your avatar milcher, i can see why you and I are both fans of saftey wire, i love the stuff.
In order for safety wire to help here, we would have to know 100% for sure that the clamped assembly never, ever compressive yields (squishes). If this is not the case, then the safety wire would do nothing except being a PITA. Someone posted that they had removed and loctited the nut...and that the torque stayed the same when checked later on. It's not possible to say whether the loctite helped, or that the torque would have been maintained anyway.

Additionally...if the car experienced an event that bent the 10 mm stud...the assembly could still be held together...the nut will not have moved on the threads due to the safety wire...but the installed tension of the fastener would be gone. Unsafe condition combined with a false sense of security? If you check torque...the low figure would lead a qualified to inspect the rest of the joint extra carefully.

Until and unless we know more, I think it's safest to do as Lotus suggests. Check the torques. After the deal is checked a time or two it will likely remain tight for the lifetime of the joint. The thing is, you need to be sure that it is 100% tight before a stressful event like a track day.

This can be very painless if you check it when the car has an oil change...at that time you'd already have arranged access to the underside of the car. So there is no extra work. All you'd do is throw a torque wrench on there for about 10 seconds per side.

The car is supposed to be delivered properly torqued from the factory. Things like this are supposed to be checked again before the car is delivered to the customer and at the 1000 mile check up. I think they mention checking torques and other things in the other service intervals already. If things like this are not being handled in service then that is an additional issue. It's also why a trusted shop or DIY work is so good for personal peace of mind.

This torque topic kind of reminds me about past discussions about wheel bolt torque. You should check all wheel bolt torques before your first track run. And between runs you should check at least 2 bolts...before the upcoming run, and after things have cooled off. You don't check right after you pull the car in and park it.

Over time you'll note that sometimes everything is okay, and other times you need to do some snugging. This is NOT because the wheel bolt (or nut) unscrewed itself. It's because the wheel, hub, etc, squished out a bit. A little bit of squish = a great deal of tension loss = retorquing will be needed. Wheels vary here.

Generally speaking...if there was some squish out...all four bolts will be affected. The most conservative strategy there is to check all the bolts. For autocross the run time is so low that a torquing before you run the car is fine. But when you bolt on your street tires...try checking the torque a day later and they may need some touchup before things stabilize.

Again, the reason we torque is to ensure that the proper tension is achieved on the fasteners. If this happens, the assembly becomes stable and the fastener won't see metal fatigue encouraging movement. Cyclical movement (as in back and forth loads on the toe links) leads to metal fatigue. If everything is torqued up properly, and the part is being used as designed, and the design is good, then you are set.
Answer:
Stan, do you by chance have a visual for all the parts in the list, as I have a friend with a lift where I could do it - I just have no idea what those parts are! (all my speeding years have been on motorcycles, so I'm stilll pretty new to cars!)
Answer:
Stan, do you by chance have a visual for all the parts in the list, as I have a friend with a lift where I could do it - I just have no idea what those parts are! (all my speeding years have been on motorcycles, so I'm stilll pretty new to cars!)
Check some of my other posts in this thread, with PICs. The toe link, the camber bolts, and the wheel bolts are the most critical items in the rear suspension. If you do track days all sorts of other things need to be checked, confirmed, and verified.
Answer:
Assuming you go around with your torque wrench and find the bolts need to be tightened, where do you draw the line between retorquing or removing and replacing? If the bolt has backed off to 70% or its spec torque? 50%? Loosened at all? I ask out of genuine interest, as I will probably go at my Speedster on the weekend with a torque wrench...
Answer:
Stan, I see no pix anywhere in this thread??
Answer:
Stan, I see no pix anywhere in this thread??
You mean as in a browser or image issue? Try post #103...it shows the nut you need to check at the inner toe link joint. And there are various other posts showing other details. Such as the rear suspension image from the service manual.
Answer:
Ahhh - thanks, I see what happened - I was forgetting we are 3 threads deep, so I was just scanning to the top of this page! I got the diagram you kindly put up in post # 88.

Stan, I wish you'd open up a Lotus shop just round the corner from me! (Please!!)
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